The Burner Blog - Latest Comments

Re: (It Seems) Mark Driscoll Thinks Wives Are Only Good for Sex

Calvin Vincent — Mon, 08 Oct 2012 12:46:33 -0000

Unfortunately, it seems that Mark may have some serious mental health issues relating to his views of and interactions with women. I didn't realize that he mentions his father often and yet rarely mentions his mother. That certainly provides further detail into what seems to be an already broken attitude toward women. I hope and pray that Mark is somehow led into quality therapy with a professional Christian psychologist. Sadly, I believe that Mars Hill rejects the very kind of therapy that Mark seems to need, and instead takes a nouthetic approach, which can be extremely harmful in these situations.

Re: Slavery More Rampant Than Ever Before–Are You Going to Preach About It?

Renae — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 14:04:01 -0000

My 8-year-old daughter, who we are foster-adopting and who is African-American, asked me this morning if (1) there is still slavery (she's watched Prince of Egypt several times), and (2) she was ever going to have to become a slave. It was so difficult to explain to her that it was illegal, but that it still happens all over the world.

Re: The Burner Went Surfing with Rob Bell–And You Can, Too

michael j. kimpan — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 13:39:23 -0000

phenomenal post. glad we had the chance to meet.

Re: An Anonymous Letter from a Hurt Female Youth Minister

The Burner — Wed, 26 Sep 2012 13:27:19 -0000

Thanks, Susan!

We will check it out.

Re: An Anonymous Letter from a Hurt Female Youth Minister

Suzan Holland — Wed, 26 Sep 2012 12:54:25 -0000

I recently heard a message at Bethel Church (Redding, CA) titled "The Invisible Ceiling" by Danny Silk that addressed this very issue. It might be great for you (and your pastors?) to lisen to. It is posted on iBethel.TV

Re: Two Important Resolutions for the New Year

Dustin Ellington — Wed, 26 Sep 2012 09:59:28 -0000

This is quite thoughtful. Thank you.

Re: Mark Driscoll’s Preoccupation with Visual Stimulation

Kimberly Furnell — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 00:06:26 -0000

That's EXACTLY what I was thinking!

Re: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly from Wild Goose West

The Burner — Mon, 10 Sep 2012 01:10:19 -0000

Thanks for your comment! I was unaware that the bartender made a public statement, but I would love to see the event page where it was addressed so I can amend this post.

Can you send it to me?

The Burner

Re: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly from Wild Goose West

Diana Liz Dettwyler — Sun, 09 Sep 2012 14:18:33 -0000

I loved the beer and hymn singing and I loved the unrefined enthusiasm expressed by the chicken puppet dancer and and found it quite refreshing. I saw and experience the sing just as a bunch of people coming together enjoying the singing of some of the common songs of the faith. I did not have high expectations for the people leading and saw them more as facilitators. Everyone seemed to have an equal part in the singing and enjoyment of being together with raised voices.

As for the tipping issue, the rant from the bartender was out of line and was posted immediately on the event page. However it was met with a gracious response from attenders. The bartender seemed to already have a beef against stingy tippers. It was clear that the expectations of the server did not match up with the type of event going on. Were the clientele supposed to tip the servers that sold soft drinks as well?

Not everyone was drinking beer in the hymn sing, so it's unfair of the server to criticize everyone at the event as being stingy Christians.

I realize I'm responding mostly to the bartender's problem, but as a whole the entire festival was great and refreshing to me. I've also been to many events and though this one wasn't perfect, it was pretty darn good!

Re: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly from Wild Goose West

The Burner — Sat, 08 Sep 2012 02:10:22 -0000

You might have a point--but a better sentence could have been constructed. I really wanted to like the beer and hymns, but the selection did indeed leave me frustrated for the reasons stated.

Re: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly from Wild Goose West

Jps — Fri, 07 Sep 2012 08:01:23 -0000

The hymns "devolved" into hymns? Methinks the blogger is straining for a reason to be unhappy...

Re: A Fuller Family’s Story of Homosexuality and Faith

Brandon — Wed, 29 Aug 2012 19:45:51 -0000

Well said and quantified. As Christians, I don't think Christ promised that our sinful leanings would be eradicated. At least that has been my experience.

Re: OMG–Politics for Church People

The Burner — Tue, 28 Aug 2012 10:59:55 -0000

Thanks for your comment, David! I appreciate your response.

I do wonder if you have ignored my whole point by referencing two hot-button issues. Christians are called to care for those in need.

While I agree that abortion is a tragedy, the Church as a whole is ill-prepared to offer care to the 1.2 million babies and mothers that abortion steals from us every year.

Don't you think that amending our Church culture of correct morality with a culture of correct action is more in line with what Jesus taught?

Re: OMG–Politics for Church People

David Skillings — Tue, 28 Aug 2012 03:02:04 -0000

"real good–like letting them be free, letting them have access to social services we don’t really want to pay for..."

depending on what this is in reference to...but if the author is suggesting that as Christians we are commanded to be concerned with the "greater good" of our neighbor, and if the author believes that Christians should accept and support (in any way) "social services" like abortion, I would disagree with extreme passion! Morality is legislated in various ways every day, in every law, and if Christians believe that we should legislate "helping the poor" through welfare and other entitlement programs, why would we not fight against issues like abortion and same-sex marriage. Looking at Christians, it seems that many are either/or...especially at Fuller! Many people are concerned about helping the poor and many believe that it is acceptable for this to be done through governmental means...why then would Christians not desire to legislate morality in banning abortions and opposing same-sex marriage? As if those two issues are insignificant to the "greater good" of our neighbor?! Both sides, and I mean BOTH sides, conservative Christians, and liberal Christians need to recognize the inconsistencies in their political ideas and to see that helping the poor is not the only thing that Jesus called his followers to do. We need to find new ways to take care of those people, rather than build a cycle of dependance in which they are trapped. But we also must vigorously fight for the rights of the unborn and in doing so, we are truly "bringing life and not oppression to those around us."

Re: Mark Driscoll’s Preoccupation with Visual Stimulation

Zack Martin — Mon, 20 Aug 2012 14:50:38 -0000

you just called another human being "crappy" and "useless"...

Re: Repenting From a Paradigm of Extraction

Jon Huckins — Wed, 08 Aug 2012 12:22:21 -0000

Colleen, part of the reason I wrote the post in this way was to spark questions like yours. I wonder what your thoughts are on what the "both/and" might look like?

Re: Repenting From a Paradigm of Extraction

The Burner — Wed, 08 Aug 2012 11:33:11 -0000

Thanks for the comment, Colleen!

Are you involved in a church that successfully does that? We'd love to hear about it!

Re: Repenting From a Paradigm of Extraction

Colleennewell — Wed, 08 Aug 2012 07:57:11 -0000

Maybe it's not a case of either or but both and. Colleen from Toronto

Re: You Can Aspire to Be Either a Lingerie Model or a Proverbs 31 Woman

Lingerie modelling — Mon, 06 Aug 2012 07:43:34 -0000

It really depends on the person. I would say it's fine to be a lingerie model or a proverbs 31 woman as long as you aren't committing crime.

Re: UPDATE: A Report From the Front Lines of the Cultural Battle: A Lubbock, TX Chick-Fil-A on August 1st

Jane Carnall — Sun, 05 Aug 2012 18:54:30 -0000

Hi Dallas,

Thanks for replying. I've re-read your post a couple of times since that initial (annoyed) comment and realised that I had rather misunderstood you - and furthermore, said something to you that you didn't need to be told. I wasn't sure whether you would read this thread, but I'd like to apologise for that.

I don't see why you shouldn't eat chicken from Chick-Fil-A. But you should know that when you took part in that Wednesday chicken-fest it hadn't anything to do with free speech (as Fred Clark at Slacktivist points out, Fred Phelps is living proof that you can speak as freely as you wish!) or love of chicken - it had to do with showing smugness, pride, and hatred to LGBT Americans.

That you realised this, is absolutely to your credit: that you wrote about the experience honestly is utterly admirable.

That you're still trying to look for a way to move us towards you is, um, slightly less admirable, but it's only human.

We can't move towards you. We can't agree to think of ourselves as less than human to make you comfortable. You have to come to us.

I want to thank you also for inspiring me to write a blogpost about the unwelcoming words of the new Bishop of Aberdeen. He said something very unpleasant about gay marriage on Friday, and I was trying to process it and with the help of your story I finally did. Thank you for that.

Re: UPDATE: A Report From the Front Lines of the Cultural Battle: A Lubbock, TX Chick-Fil-A on August 1st

DallasFromTexas — Sat, 04 Aug 2012 15:23:41 -0000

Dear EdinburghEye,

I think you missed the point of my original FB post. I wasn't trying to tell anyone they were sinners. in fact, it was my hope to do just the opposite. If you'll re-read my words, you'll notice that I said nothing to the fact that the folks who were protesting the protest were wrong or sinners. I said, or at least tried to say that I love you. and I am sorry. And, hopefully you will also notice that I did point out that the caped girl WAS acting like Christ. That was the whole point of why i was undone. Finally, I do have the right to patronize a store for any reason that i feel... Whether it is to support free speech or whether it's just to eat some chicken. the truth is, people get their feelings hurt about all sorts of stuff. i got my feelings hurt as i read these posts because I truly am trying to be open and hear a different perspective and honestly just Love people whether they are gay/straight black/brown/white, Christian/Muslim or whatever, and here you are criticizing my legitimate heartfelt effort. but, it is your right to speak your mind just as much as it is my right to support what i believe in.

i think what is being lost here is that I am trying to find middle ground where we can all look eye to eye and be real and be kind, and start a conversation that isn't laced with hate and preconceived ideas about what gay people are and what pastors or conservatives or rightwingers are. everyone needs to move to the middle. the thing that happned at chick fil a was a step for me if nothing else.

Re: UPDATE: A Report From the Front Lines of the Cultural Battle: A Lubbock, TX Chick-Fil-A on August 1st

Jon Weimer, Ph.D. — Sat, 04 Aug 2012 07:55:11 -0000

You were undone, because Jesus, if there is such a person, was speaking to you through this person and telling you to turn away from prejudice. Jesus said the second greatest commandment is to love your neighbor as yourself. Like many Christians, there is a fundamental flaw in your reasoning. How is it any of your business if someone is gay or lesbian in the first place? How is it that it is your business if someone is prideful, adulterous, a liar, or a cheat. Like many of your bretheren, you seem to forget that Jesus also said:

1 JUDGE not, that ye be not judged. 2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. 3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? 4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? 5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

- Matthew 7:1-5

Re: UPDATE: A Report From the Front Lines of the Cultural Battle: A Lubbock, TX Chick-Fil-A on August 1st

dmeconis — Fri, 03 Aug 2012 16:27:44 -0000

Please tell you're friend that I'm lesbian and a Christian, and that I was raised in a church community that sees absolutely no conflict between the two. I would love to have a conversation with your friend about it, and about that experience outside the restaurant, any time.

For what it is worth, here are my thoughts, addressed to your friend.

----

A few years ago, I shared a bus with a middle-aged man. He was clearly a person who faced regular difficulties - his clothes were worn and his hair was wild. For most of the ride he sat and fidgeted, smiling to himself at odd moments. Everybody on the bus wore that expression of uncertain tension - was he preparing for an outburst? The driver was a sweet-faced young woman who seemed to be on her first week at the job, instead of the usual stern road veteran who can be trusted to tolerate no nonsense from a troubled passenger.

A few stops before mine, the man pulled the cord to get off.

As the bus pulled up to the curb, he abruptly stood. He planted his feet right at the front of the bus, turned to his fellow passengers (who universally cringed in anticipation), spread his arms wide, and then hollered: "PEACE BE WITH YOU!"

Without hesitation, a sunny smile on her face, the driver replied: "And also with you!"

And the man beamed, and stepped off the bus, and we drove away.

I suppose that I ride the bus with Christ every day, but that day, he was a little easier to recognize him.

It seems from your writing that you recently had a similar encounter.
It is my great and constant grief that so many LGBT people (and the people who love them) who could benefit from and blossom within a loving faith community are told that there is no room for them at God's table, or that their share of the feast of divine love is somehow not as generous as that given to effortlessly heterosexual followers of Christ. The point that always baffles me is - does a straight person who's never seen my face actually better know me better than I know myself? Do they really know God's plan for me, or have they devoted more thought to it, than I have? It seems like profound arrogance to claim such a thing. I'm furthermore not an addict or somebody afflicted with a severe mental disorder, biologically unable to determine and pursue my own best interest.Is it really believable that every gay person on earth is so shattered and confused that they are unable to tell happiness and love from misery and enslavement? How is it that so many of us pursue rewarding careers, raise children, participate in communities, and generally lead healthy and well-adjusted and, yes, Christian lives if we're so disturbed? I think the simple fact is that many of my fellow Christians do not know how many gay people exist in their lives, simply because they assume that all of us must be visibly broken or debauched. They do not recognize a gay person unless there is a rainbow flag, or they inadvertently edit out my own rather obvious gayness because I do not conform to expectations. Surely, if I were gay, I would be a sex addict, or on drugs, or profoundly lonely or unfulfilled in my relationships, or faithless, or alienated from family and friends. And I am (through the grace of God) none of those things.When Rick Santorum posts that he's enjoying a chicken sandwich in support of Dan Cathy's comments, what I hear is that he is literally feasting on his own righteous certainty that some of the most essential joys of my life are worthless and demeaning. That the tears of holy joy I shed when I married my wife after three years, that the words of sanctification our pastor spoke at the ceremony (risking his position in the church to do so), that the love and enjoyment our families take from our union, that all the times my closest friends have told me "I'm so glad you two met. You are so much happier together, and I love you both", that when my wife says, as she does nearly every day, "I love the life I get to live with you" - that every single one of us must be horribly, grievously, even maliciously mistaken. God is the only being who truly knows what love is. It is our task on this earth to learn to recognize God's love and to seek it out, and when we find it to give it to others in the ways they need it most.Love isn't a fistful of coins to be hoarded and doled out only after a stringent moral test. Love is a basket of loaves and fish. It multiplies as we share it in the great and ephemeral gathering that is our lives together on earth. That costumed protestor was the one of the few people that day who didn't show up to buy food from an approved vendor. She came to share her portion of a more universal feast.I'm so glad that you were ready to receive it. May it be just one of many times in a life lived well, and with love.

Re: UPDATE: A Report From the Front Lines of the Cultural Battle: A Lubbock, TX Chick-Fil-A on August 1st

Georgia Leigh — Fri, 03 Aug 2012 12:01:46 -0000

I wrote this for my LGBT friends after all this. Thanks for sharing your heart.

http://youtu.be/LCpYClYzLmA

Re: UPDATE: A Report From the Front Lines of the Cultural Battle: A Lubbock, TX Chick-Fil-A on August 1st

chrisalgoo — Fri, 03 Aug 2012 08:51:36 -0000

The "sinner" was more Christlike than the Christians. Something to think about.